The last circulating gold coins?

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What were the last gold coins in active circulation?

I don't mean commemorative coins where the bullion value exceeded the face value, and I don't mean gold coins that were minted in small numbers for collectors that were technically legal tender but very rare in circulation, and I don't mean gold coins that existed only to facilitate cash transfers within banks (if that was ever a thing and they didn't just use banknotes).

I mean actual common everyday circulation.
My guess would be:
https://en.numista.com/catalogue/pieces63078.html
Numista referee for Finland
I did numista search and these were the latest circulating non commemorative gold coins:
https://en.numista.com/catalogue/pieces22708.html
https://en.numista.com/catalogue/pieces34945.html
https://en.numista.com/catalogue/pieces25037.html
https://en.numista.com/catalogue/pieces17856.html
Numista referee for Finland
And to add a more specific variation on this question, did the UK 1/2 sovereign and 1 pound sovereign coins circulate freely in everyday commerce? If you went to Harrods in 1905 to buy a comfy chair, might you actually pay with a gold sovereign or two?
Quote: "Jesse11"​And to add a more specific variation on this question, did the UK 1/2 sovereign and 1 pound sovereign coins circulate freely in everyday commerce? If you went to Harrods in 1905 to buy a comfy chair, might you actually pay with a gold sovereign or two?
​Paying with gold wasn't anything special back in early 20th century europe, it was rare because not that many people could ever had such a large amount of money.

You don't see 500 euro notes or singaporean 10,000 dollar notes in circulation very often for the same reason.
Numista referee for Finland
Quote: "Hopeakettu"You don't see 500 euro notes in circulation very often for the same reason.
The main reason you seldom see 500 euro notes is because there are not many places where these still will be accepted. Even the big supermarket chains don't accept it because they are afraid of forgeries.
Quote: "Hopeakettu"I did numista search and these were the latest circulating non commemorative gold coins:
https://en.numista.com/catalogue/pieces22708.html
It's not because the Numista coin page doesn't say it is a "non circulating issue" that this coin effectively circulated. We all know there are a lot of mistakes in Krause nowadays, but we have to assume there are also mistakes in our catalog and maybe this is one of them.

Of course I can't know it for sure but it's really hard to believe a gold coin with a weight of more than 81 grams and a diameter of almost 50 mm would actually have been circulated.
Besides, when a coin (gold or not) actually circulates, it's the face value that counts, and not the value of the metal it's made of. At the end of the '70's when this coin was issued 1 pahlavi was 100 rial, so this coin of 10 pahlavi was 1,000 rial. Of course now we are in 2016, but now 1,000 rial is only worth 0.029 € (less than 3 euro cents) while the bullion value of the 10 pahlavi coin is now 2,842.38 €. Hard to believe 37 years earlier the bullion value would have matched the face value. So in my opinion, this coin never circulated.
Maybe some Iranian members can confirm it (or not)?

By the way, while I was looking at the Iranian coins, this section of the catalog is still a mess. Look at the "Pahlavi Dynasty" (beginning at the bottom of page 5 and page 6). These coins aren't sorted out by denomination at all. For instance at the top of page 6: first a few 2500 dinar, then a few 25 dinar, then a few 5000 dinar, next some 50 dinar, then a few 1 pahlavi (= 100 rial), next 1 rial....
We still have a lot of work to do but of course this takes time and the catalog is improving daily.
The last gold coins disappeared from circulation when during the Great Depression countries abandoned the gold standard as a basis of their financial system. In Europe (Britain, Germany, Austria) this happened in 1931, in the US in 1934, other countries somewhere in between.

I remember reading that in South Africa gold coins continued to circulate freely in early 1932, after they were discontinued in Britain. As a result, many British travelers brought bags full of their silver coins (which were also legal tender in South Africa until 1939), exchanged them for gold coins in South Africa and departed with gold coins to Britain where they cost more than "equal" amount in silver coinage. South Africa had therefore to remove gold coins from circulation in 1932 in order to save its financial system from such widespread robbery.

Later than say 1935 "circulation" gold coins issued in many countries are in fact bullion gold intended not for circulation, but for saving, accumulation of gold. They are collected of course by coin collectors, the same way as we collect brass, bronze and silver coins, but if ever used for payments (outside collector world), later gold coins are traded as metal by weight and fineness, without consideration of their denomination.
I collect coins and tokens which circulated in Africa from 18th century to 2000. I sell about 7000 illustrated world coins from http://www.avscoins.com.
Quote: "Essor Prof"
Quote: "Hopeakettu"You don't see 500 euro notes in circulation very often for the same reason.
​The main reason you seldom see 500 euro notes is because there are not many places where these still will be accepted. Even the big supermarket chains don't accept it because they are afraid of forgeries.
​Depends on the country, here in finland you can buy a lollipop with a 500 euro note if the supermarket has enough change which they always do unless it's a very small shop.
They check every banknote one by one to see if they're authentic even in regular-sized supermarkets.
Numista referee for Finland
Quote: "Essor Prof"
Quote: "Hopeakettu"I did numista search and these were the latest circulating non commemorative gold coins:
https://en.numista.com/catalogue/pieces22708.html
​It's not because the Numista coin page doesn't say it is a "non circulating issue" that this coin effectively circulated. We all know there are a lot of mistakes in Krause nowadays, but we have to assume there are also mistakes in our catalog and maybe this is one of them.

​Of course I can't know it for sure but it's really hard to believe a gold coin with a weight of more than 81 grams and a diameter of almost 50 mm would actually have been circulated.
​Besides, when a coin (gold or not) actually circulates, it's the face value that counts, and not the value of the metal it's made of. At the end of the '70's when this coin was issued 1 pahlavi was 100 rial, so this coin of 10 pahlavi was 1,000 rial. Of course now we are in 2016, but now 1,000 rial is only worth 0.029 € (less than 3 euro cents) while the bullion value of the 10 pahlavi coin is now 2,842.38 €. Hard to believe 37 years earlier the bullion value would have matched the face value. So in my opinion, this coin never circulated.
​Maybe some Iranian members can confirm it (or not)?

​By the way, while I was looking at the Iranian coins, this section of the catalog is still a mess. Look at the "Pahlavi Dynasty" (beginning at the bottom of page 5 and page 6). These coins aren't sorted out by denomination at all. For instance at the top of page 6: first a few 2500 dinar, then a few 25 dinar, then a few 5000 dinar, next some 50 dinar, then a few 1 pahlavi (= 100 rial), next 1 rial....
​We still have a lot of work to do but of course this takes time and the catalog is improving daily.
http://archive.aramcoworld.com/issue/196901/the.riyal-a.miracle.in.money.htm
http://www.sama.gov.sa/en-US/Currency/Pages/HistoricalInfo.aspx
Numista referee for Finland
Quote: "Hopeakettu"Depends on the country, here in finland you can buy a lollipop with a 500 euro note if the supermarket has enough change which they always do unless it's a very small shop.
They check every banknote one by one to see if they're authentic even in regular-sized supermarkets.
Of course I can only speak for my own country (Belgium) and here it's not easy to get rid of a 500 euro note. I never had a problem at coin fairs or in my gas station, but in supermarkets they are not allowed.

It won't be a problem anymore in the future. The 500 euro notes will be taken out of circulation in 2018 without replacing so the 200 euro note will be the highest note. No worries, the 500 euro notes stay valid for life but all the notes arriving at a Bank will never see circulation again.
Quote: "Hopeakettu"http://archive.aramcoworld.com/issue/196901/the.riyal-a.miracle.in.money.htm
http://www.sama.gov.sa/en-US/Currency/Pages/HistoricalInfo.aspx
Hmmm, I can't follow. I was talking about that 1978-1979 gold coin from Iran and a possible enormous inflation between 1979 and 2016 in that country and then you provide some links about Saudi Arabia and the situation there, mainly in the 1950's?

I guess the post from "Andrey" on 3-Aug-2016, 04:11AM, makes a lot of sense.
Quote: "Essor Prof"
Quote: "Hopeakettu"I did numista search and these were the latest circulating non commemorative gold coins:
https://en.numista.com/catalogue/pieces22708.html
​It's not because the Numista coin page doesn't say it is a "non circulating issue" that this coin effectively circulated. We all know there are a lot of mistakes in Krause nowadays, but we have to assume there are also mistakes in our catalog and maybe this is one of them.

​Of course I can't know it for sure but it's really hard to believe a gold coin with a weight of more than 81 grams and a diameter of almost 50 mm would actually have been circulated.
​Besides, when a coin (gold or not) actually circulates, it's the face value that counts, and not the value of the metal it's made of. At the end of the '70's when this coin was issued 1 pahlavi was 100 rial, so this coin of 10 pahlavi was 1,000 rial. Of course now we are in 2016, but now 1,000 rial is only worth 0.029 € (less than 3 euro cents) while the bullion value of the 10 pahlavi coin is now 2,842.38 €. Hard to believe 37 years earlier the bullion value would have matched the face value. So in my opinion, this coin never circulated.
​Maybe some Iranian members can confirm it (or not)?

​By the way, while I was looking at the Iranian coins, this section of the catalog is still a mess. Look at the "Pahlavi Dynasty" (beginning at the bottom of page 5 and page 6). These coins aren't sorted out by denomination at all. For instance at the top of page 6: first a few 2500 dinar, then a few 25 dinar, then a few 5000 dinar, next some 50 dinar, then a few 1 pahlavi (= 100 rial), next 1 rial....
​We still have a lot of work to do but of course this takes time and the catalog is improving daily.
​HI everyone
Regarding the Iranian coinage, I try to give help mrfane (https://en.numista.com/echanges/profil.php?id=44722) to catalog the best of this section.
I tried to divide the coinage for the dynasty, it seemed the right thing.
however for confirmation of the circulation or not a coin, if you have doubts, mrfane will give you a concrete answer.
Quote: "simoneo80"Regarding the Iranian coinage, I tried to divide the coinage for the dynasty, it seemed the right thing.
Hi Simoneo80, no problem with dividing the coinage per dynasty. But within the dynasty, the coinage should be sorted by denomination, like it is in every other country.
I believe Iran isn't the most easy country to sort, so I suppose it's still a work in progress and I'm a patient man but sooner or later this country also should be sorted correctly.
Quote: "Essor Prof"
Quote: "simoneo80"Regarding the Iranian coinage, I tried to divide the coinage for the dynasty, it seemed the right thing.
​Hi Simoneo80, no problem with dividing the coinage per dynasty. But within the dynasty, the coinage should be sorted by denomination, like it is in every other country.
​I believe Iran isn't the most easy country to sort, so I suppose it's still a work in progress and I'm a patient man but sooner or later this country also should be sorted correctly.
​all possible help and new ideas on how to categorize this section, are welcome ;)
Quote: "Essor Prof"
Quote: "Hopeakettu"I did numista search and these were the latest circulating non commemorative gold coins:
https://en.numista.com/catalogue/pieces22708.html
​It's not because the Numista coin page doesn't say it is a "non circulating issue" that this coin effectively circulated. We all know there are a lot of mistakes in Krause nowadays, but we have to assume there are also mistakes in our catalog and maybe this is one of them.
​Definitely. I'm not really sure what counts as a "non-circulating issue", anyway.

(And the Chile 20 pesos type sounds like it was made for circulation once in 1926, and then again with the same specifications for bullion decades later - and the Numista page doesn't distinguish between the two versions. I'm pretty sure there were other types like that as well; the Soviet chervonets comes to mind - though the 1923 version didn't really circulate either.)

Quote: "Essor Prof"​Of course I can't know it for sure but it's really hard to believe a gold coin with a weight of more than 81 grams and a diameter of almost 50 mm would actually have been circulated.
​Besides, when a coin (gold or not) actually circulates, it's the face value that counts, and not the value of the metal it's made of. At the end of the '70's when this coin was issued 1 pahlavi was 100 rial, so this coin of 10 pahlavi was 1,000 rial. Of course now we are in 2016, but now 1,000 rial is only worth 0.029 € (less than 3 euro cents) while the bullion value of the 10 pahlavi coin is now 2,842.38 €. Hard to believe 37 years earlier the bullion value would have matched the face value. So in my opinion, this coin never circulated.
​Maybe some Iranian members can confirm it (or not)?
​Bullion value of gold rose a lot between the 1970s and today, while the Iranian rial took a lot of heavy inflation, so it's not that unlikely.

As far as I understand, the late 1970s gold pahlavi was actually 1000 rials, which would technically fit the bullion value fairly closely. In practice, I'm pretty sure those coins stopped actually circulating a lot earlier.

Quote: "Essor Prof"​By the way, while I was looking at the Iranian coins, this section of the catalog is still a mess. Look at the "Pahlavi Dynasty" (beginning at the bottom of page 5 and page 6). These coins aren't sorted out by denomination at all. For instance at the top of page 6: first a few 2500 dinar, then a few 25 dinar, then a few 5000 dinar, next some 50 dinar, then a few 1 pahlavi (= 100 rial), next 1 rial....
​We still have a lot of work to do but of course this takes time and the catalog is improving daily.
​I guess it's because the underlying values are all in one currency, but the people entering the coins don't know that and enter them in different currencies.
The specific examples you give look like a rial is 100 dinars, and the underlying values are supposed to be in dinars but are sometimes entered in rials. I don't know enough to tell if that's actually the case (and I think it's actually 1000 dinars per rial, in which case I don't know what's going on at all).
Gibraltar had gold coins issued at face value in the 1990s. They were intended for circulation.
Library Media Specialist, columnist, collector, and gardener...
Essor prof, sorry I posted wrong links.
Numista referee for Finland
No problem Hopeakettu, I had that impression.
I think topic must be moved to the " free discussion"
Quote: "Dato Mikeladze"​I think topic must be moved to the " free discussion"
​Why? I thought the question "what were the last gold coins that actually circulated as currency" is very much a numismatic question.
Quote: "January First-of-May"As far as I understand, the late 1970s gold pahlavi was actually 1000 rials.

The specific examples you give look like a rial is 100 dinars, and the underlying values are supposed to be in dinars but are sometimes entered in rials. I don't know enough to tell if that's actually the case (and I think it's actually 1000 dinars per rial).
The relation Pahlavi - Rial is more difficult than I (or we) thought:

- The Law of 18 March 1930 fixed the gold Pahlavi at 20 Rial.
- The Law of 20 March 1932 divided the Pahlavi into 100 Rial instead of 20.
- Since 1937 gold has been allowed to float and the Pahlavi is quoted daily in Riyal in the marketplace.

However the catalog "Current Coins of the World, 6th editon (1974)" by R.S.Yeoman still stated "100 Rial = 1 Pahlavi" (page 137).

Anyway, a floating Pahlavi course makes it more difficult to sort our catalog by denomination. Where do you have to put Pahlavi coins between Riyal coins when the course is constantly changing? And I have no doubt that over the years this change was significant (with a bullion price going up and a Rial due to inflation going down).

Concerning the rate of the dinar:

Monetary system (from 1932 to date):
5 Dinars = 1 Shahi
20 Shahis = 1 Rial

So 100 Dinars = 1 Rial

Maybe you got confused by the following:

Monetary system (1825 - 1931):
50 Dinars = 1 Shahi
20 Shahis = 1 Kran (Qiran)

S0 1000 Dinars = 1 Kran (Qiran)

or
Monetary system (1798 - 1825):
1250 Dinars = 1 Rial.
Having a look at the traditionally 'hard currency' countries:

Switzerland: 20 Franken, last gold issue in 1949 with 10 million minted.
https://en.numista.com/catalogue/pieces7497.html
Switzerland was the last country upholding the gold standard in what used to be the Latin monetary union.
I'm not sure the post WW-II 20 franken gold coins effectively circulated, despite their high mintage.

The Netherlands: 10 Guilders, last gold issue in 1933 with 2,462,101 minted
https://en.numista.com/catalogue/pieces24451.html
The Netherlands left the gold standard in 1936.
Gwyde
Thanks, Gwyde, those are interesting, with high enough mintage that I would believe they were intended to circulate. And how much do you think you could buy with 10 gulden in 1933? I assume gold has gone up relatively to actual goods since then; in other words, I presume 10 gulden didn't have the buying power of $265 today.

Just trying to get a historical sense for the kinds of purchases where people would actually pay with gold coins.
A UK inflation calculator suggests that 1 gold sovereign (i.e., £1) in 1925 had the buying power of £51 today, but that same gold sovereign has a bullion value of £245 right now. So I guess gold was not nearly as expensive back then, relatively speaking.
Quote: "Jesse11"​A UK inflation calculator suggests that 1 gold sovereign (i.e., £1) in 1925 had the buying power of £51 today, but that same gold sovereign has a bullion value of £245 right now. So I guess gold was not nearly as expensive back then, relatively speaking.


Even in 1979 gold wasn't worth nearly as much as it is today
Numista referee for Finland
It's not an easy question: most of our industrial products were not around in 1933 and many commodities are mainly used by industry, not by the consumer. Got the price of a loaf of bread in the 1930's in the Netherlands:

http://www.oudommen.nl/terugkijken-met-bats-in-de-jaren-30-kostte-een-brood-16-cent-nu-bijna-het-dertigvoudige/

The 10 guilders would buy you 63 loafs of bread with 2 cents of change left.

At the other hand, regular wages in industry would be around 25 cents per hour or 2 guilders per day. One week per year of paid holidays were only introduced in the late 1930's.
There's still plenty of archives, but very little has been digitized and almost nothing is free on-line.

For some dull reason, the publicly available CPI data in the Netherlands only go back to 1963.
Gwyde
Until WW1 gold coins were quite common, as most industrial nations' currencies were on a gold standard. Until 1873 there was a bi-metal standard of 15:1 gold vs. silver. The abundance of silver ended that ratio and silver dropped in price in gold terms.

WW1 ended almost all gold standards. Some countries managed to return to this standard, sometimes at pre-WW1 rates or else at different rates. In the Netherlands I believe the 10 Gulden at some point was set to 12.50 Gulden in silver, even though the denominatiom remained the same. I am not sure when that exactly happened.

The Great Depression caused many countries to leave the gold standard and implement competitive devaluations (it's happening today as well). This marked the end of gold in most countries. Switzerland and the Netherlands were one of the last to devalue. Germany also did not devalue in the 1930's, because of the bad memories of the hyperinflation of 1923 (and the Third Reich was pretty isolated financially anyway). These attitudes towards sound money can still be observed today in these countries.

After WW2 gold was fixed to 35 Dollars per ounce, but gold did not circulate anymore between private individuals.

Here's actually an exchange rate table from 1938 published in a Berlin newspaper:

It is not possible to answer this question exactly. Gold coins were being used as a mode of transactions since ancient time. However, different countries have different coin history and thus it is not exactly possible to say when were the gold coins circulated last. However, records show that the last gold coins for commercial purpose were in circulation till the late 1930s during the time of The Great Depression.
Gold coins are still minted today, but only as a means of investment. The gold coin price is much higher today and depends solely on its purity. For instance, a pure 24-carat gold coin is priced much higher than a 22-carat gold coin that contains alloys of copper and silver.
Most of the coins that were circulated for transactional purposes in the ancient times were alloys. However, from a collector’s point of view, the value of such ancient gold coins is much higher than pure gold coins in the market.

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