Menu

Elongated Pennies

» Quick access to the last post

Author Message
Indomini16
Joined: 12-Jun-2017
Posts: 339
Hello,
Do someone else have elongated pennie like this one ?
Is it really common?
I spot a Machine in Toledo, but I never pay attention before;


Is it an idea to add it to the Token section of the catalogue?
Thanks all in advance for your feed back !
Always look on the bright side of life!
Idolenz
Joined: 13-Jul-2013
Posts: 2008
I think they were all removed in "Token-Gate"
To me they are simply post mint damaged coins, but I don't like tokens in general :°
              
Indomini16
Joined: 12-Jun-2017
Posts: 339
Quote: "Idolenz"​I think they were all removed in "Token-Gate"
​To me they are simply post mint damaged coins, but I don't like tokens in general :°
​Sorry but what was the "Token-Gate" (I mean I understand what it could be, but when did it took place and what was the consequences?)
As you, I don't like token but when you buy coins in bulk you often find some, so I put them in my swap list because I respect those who like to collect it, and if I can please someone that's ok for me I just don't have the same hobby.
Always look on the bright side of life!
Jarcek Numista team
Joined: 22-Dec-2014
Posts: 5332
Tokens created from coins made by (in many cases just one person) people were deleted. Carved things, things with colored stamps on coins, gold plated ones and elongated pennies. "Damaged coins" was other term for it as well.
Catalogue administrator, Referee for Kingdom of Bohemia.
Indomini16
Joined: 12-Jun-2017
Posts: 339
Quote: "Jarcek"​Tokens created from coins made by (in many cases just one person) people were deleted. Carved things, things with colored stamps on coins, gold plated ones and elongated pennies. "Damaged coins" was other term for it as well.
​I fully agree with that, but those elongated penny are sold as Tourism token, no ?
Always look on the bright side of life!
Mark240590
Joined: 3-Jul-2012
Posts: 5567
I don’t really think these have any place in the catalogue. I have some stretched pennies from Gibraltar and a stretched 5€ Cent.
BRITISH EMPIRE COLLECTION FOR SALE.INBOX ME IF YOU WANY ANY.

MAY SWAP FOR DURHAM AND NORTHUMBERLAND CONDER TOKENS OR OLD GIBRALTAR QUART COINS/ TOKENS
derf
Joined: 11-Mar-2012
Posts: 1562
Quote: "Mark240590"​I don’t really think these have any place in the catalogue. I have some stretched pennies from Gibraltar and a stretched 5€ Cent.
​I believe that they are tokens and have as much right to be in the catalog as shopping card tokens do ..
? Format  Format  Format ?   ?
Do not argue with ignorant people .. !! They will drag you down to their level, then pulverize you with experience ...
Mark240590
Joined: 3-Jul-2012
Posts: 5567
Quote: "derf"
Quote: "Mark240590"​I don’t really think these have any place in the catalogue. I have some stretched pennies from Gibraltar and a stretched 5€ Cent.
​​I believe that they are tokens and have as much right to be in the catalog as shopping card tokens do ..
​Don’t they have a monetary value ?
BRITISH EMPIRE COLLECTION FOR SALE.INBOX ME IF YOU WANY ANY.

MAY SWAP FOR DURHAM AND NORTHUMBERLAND CONDER TOKENS OR OLD GIBRALTAR QUART COINS/ TOKENS
derf
Joined: 11-Mar-2012
Posts: 1562
Quote: "Mark240590"
Quote: "derf"
Quote: "Mark240590"​I don’t really think these have any place in the catalogue. I have some stretched pennies from Gibraltar and a stretched 5€ Cent.
​​​I believe that they are tokens and have as much right to be in the catalog as shopping card tokens do ..
​​Don’t they have a monetary value ?
​No .. Any resemblance of a penny or monetary indication is obliterated when the penny is pressed with the die ... So therefore it looses it's monetary value as a penny and becomes a tourist token ..
? Format  Format  Format ?   ?
Do not argue with ignorant people .. !! They will drag you down to their level, then pulverize you with experience ...
Jarcek Numista team
Joined: 22-Dec-2014
Posts: 5332
No matter what use they might have, they are still not admitted.
Catalogue administrator, Referee for Kingdom of Bohemia.
derf
Joined: 11-Mar-2012
Posts: 1562
Quote: "Jarcek"​No matter what use they might have, they are still not admitted.
​Then the whole token part of the Numista catalog should be deleted ...
? Format  Format  Format ?   ?
Do not argue with ignorant people .. !! They will drag you down to their level, then pulverize you with experience ...
Jarcek Numista team
Joined: 22-Dec-2014
Posts: 5332
Whole token catalogue is consisting of tokens made from destroyed coins? I guess not.
Catalogue administrator, Referee for Kingdom of Bohemia.
derf
Joined: 11-Mar-2012
Posts: 1562
Quote: "Jarcek"​Whole token catalogue is consisting of tokens made from destroyed coins? I guess not.
​What difference does it make as to what the token is made from .. ???

So go through the catalog and delete all tokens that are not made of metal and there will be room for the elongated penny tokens ...
? Format  Format  Format ?   ?
Do not argue with ignorant people .. !! They will drag you down to their level, then pulverize you with experience ...
derf
Joined: 11-Mar-2012
Posts: 1562
An elongated penny tourist token is more of a token than this :::

https://en.numista.com/catalogue/pieces120472.html
? Format  Format  Format ?   ?
Do not argue with ignorant people .. !! They will drag you down to their level, then pulverize you with experience ...
Jarcek Numista team
Joined: 22-Dec-2014
Posts: 5332
It makes a difference between being and not being in the catalogue.
Catalogue administrator, Referee for Kingdom of Bohemia.
omarove
Joined: 10-Nov-2012
Posts: 77
Quote: "derf"​An elongated penny tourist token is more of a token than this :::

https://en.numista.com/catalogue/pieces120472.html
​Why would this be in the catalog? :D LOL
Omarove
jim275
Joined: 26-May-2013
Posts: 98
Here's a few that I've picked up at coin shows.

2011 ANA show, Pittsburgh, PA (American Numismatic Association)
2016 Winter FUN show, Tampa, FL (Florida United Numismatists)
2017 Winter FUN show, Fort Lauderdale, FL
and two from the 2017 World's Fair of Money in Denver, CO.
------------------------------
Would they classify as Exonumia if they had used blanks instead of US pennies?
If anyone is interested, the website for "The Elongated Collectors" is http://tecnews.org/
Numista referee for Switzerland, Swiss cantons
ken6528
Joined: 11-Sep-2009
Posts: 1196
What about all the tokens that have no value. They are just souvenirs. Most of the new tokens added today have no value. Like this new token just added.
https://en.numista.com/catalogue/pieces123766.html
Numista referee for British Antarctic Territory, British Indian Ocean Territory, United States, Fiji, Cook Islands, Philippines, Vanuatu
Jesse11
Joined: 30-Dec-2015
Posts: 1089
The difference between elongated/pressed pennies and shopping cart tokens is that the pennies are the result of "post-mint damage" and were not intentionally minted that way. They are similar to if someone made jewelry out of coins. Perhaps collectable in their own right, but not really part of numismatics.
Idolenz
Joined: 13-Jul-2013
Posts: 2008
Quote: "derf"​​https://en.numista.com/catalogue/pieces120472.html

Damn I always thought the token section contains questionable stuff but those take the cake!
We could add THOSE fine specimens too. :x
              
dltcoins
Joined: 26-Apr-2017
Posts: 306
Some are interesting and historical, such as this example from the 1904 Louisiana Purchase Exposition (World's Fair) in St. Louis, made with a contemporary Indian cent.

Admittedly, it's no Barbie plastic "Play Token" or Reader's Digest "Lucky Sweepstakes Coin". Standards are standards, after all.
https://en.numista.com/catalogue/pieces120605.html
https://en.numista.com/catalogue/pieces70619.html
derf
Joined: 11-Mar-2012
Posts: 1562
Quote: "Jesse11"​The difference between elongated/pressed pennies and shopping cart tokens is that the pennies are the result of "post-mint damage" and were not intentionally minted that way. They are similar to if someone made jewelry out of coins. Perhaps collectable in their own right, but not really part of numismatics.
​I SAY AGAIN ...  !!!! To what difference as to what the token is made of matter .. A token is a token ..  !!!!!!
? Format  Format  Format ?   ?
Do not argue with ignorant people .. !! They will drag you down to their level, then pulverize you with experience ...
derf
Joined: 11-Mar-2012
Posts: 1562
Quote: "derf"
Quote: "Jesse11"​The difference between elongated/pressed pennies and shopping cart tokens is that the pennies are the result of "post-mint damage" and were not intentionally minted that way. They are similar to if someone made jewelry out of coins. Perhaps collectable in their own right, but not really part of numismatics.
​​I SAY AGAIN ...  !!!! To what difference as to what the token is made of matter .. A token is a token ..  !!!!!!
​As far as that goes, using your criteria of "post-mint damage", all of the counter-stamped coins should be removed from the catalog, because that counter-stamp is "post-mint damage" ...

Furthermore, please give an example from "any" numismatic reference that includes or excludes an item "solely" based on the method or process which was sued to create the item ..  !!!!!!!!

To conclude, one of the definitions of a token is: A souvenir or keepsake .. Of which, an enlogated penny tourist token qualifies ...
? Format  Format  Format ?   ?
Do not argue with ignorant people .. !! They will drag you down to their level, then pulverize you with experience ...
ken6528
Joined: 11-Sep-2009
Posts: 1196
There is also plastic play money listed.
Numista referee for British Antarctic Territory, British Indian Ocean Territory, United States, Fiji, Cook Islands, Philippines, Vanuatu
Essor Prof
Joined: 13-Apr-2015
Posts: 2029
Quote: "derf"​​​As far as that goes, using your criteria of "post-mint damage", all of the counter-stamped coins should be removed from the catalog, because that counter-stamp is "post-mint damage" ...



​It depends. How can you call a counter-stamped coin counter-stamped at the Mint a "post-mint damage"?
There is a big difference between a coin like this (https://en.numista.com/catalogue/pieces22267.html), which certainly deserves its place in our catalogue and a coin where I knocked my initials on with a hammer.
Pcoetzee5
Joined: 19-Jul-2012
Posts: 145
I know Jarcek, like many other admin, is very much against the elongated pennies/5 cents/coins/post-production-damaged-tourist-tokens, and that they were removed during the "clean-up".

I also know there are many collectors who are against collecting tokens, non-circulation coins, or UNC coins or for that matter proof coins.

That is the beauty of our hobby, we can decide what we would like to collect. Personally I like collecting these Post-production-damaged-tourist-tokens. I have some made in Germany, with foreign coins, and even of places that no longer exist.

Somehow I find it sad that we can not add these Post-production-damaged-tourist-tokens to the website. I love this website, as I can add all my coins here, with their variations, mint marks, comments, etc. And even more, I can add new coins, tokens, etc. and they are on line as soon as they have been moderated. I know, I do moderation work too.

Jarcek, perhaps it is time that we accept that we have different desires for our hobby and that we create a seperate section for Post-production-damaged-tourist-tokens, like tokens and ex-whatever. I will be prepared to take this section on as one of my Moderation parts. I am sure I will need your support from time to time, but this is one of the additions we can add to make the site even more comprehensive, and support those who would like to collect these Post-production-damaged-tourist-tokens.

Think about it.
Ex-South African now living in Germany
MonaSeaclaid
Joined: 21-Jan-2016
Posts: 999
I wouldn't begin to give poor Jarcek more work on this catalogue. The work that's been done has been fantastic and well thought out and certainly of benefit to not only the members of this community but the general public as well. If Jarcek says he's not adding these tokens then I say fair enough. He's not obligated to do this work. He's doing it voluntarily, and he's been doing an amazing job.

That said, I'm really surprised at the general attitude here. I don't think it's an unfair question to wonder why these are excluded, and to see that the answer from so many members is "because we said so" is discouraging, especially since up to this point I've seen nothing but an open-minded community sharing in a a collective but infinitely varied love of numismatics.

These tokens are a universally accepted field of exonumia. Just like medallions, wooden and plastic coinage, hobo nickels and...all other tokens. I don't personally collect them, but to see them completely excluded is disheartening.

I think if we are calling these post-mint damage then we also have to classify all counterstamps the same way. That would include chop marks, merchant stamps and lover's initials. And I think that's fair. It is effectively damage done to the coin post-mint, during the circulating lifespan of the coin. But what makes the elongated pennies irrelevant and the chop marks prized? Personal opinion, nothing more.

As for the comparison of someone making jewellery out of the coins, with the exception of those absolutely horrific rings I see all over the place I've never seen anyone here refer to a coin with a brooch backing attached to it as "not a coin" or "not relevant". Some people won't collect them but in my, admittedly short, time on the forum I've just never seen a complete disregard of the item, or calling it anything but a coin with damage on it.

I'd also have to argue against the point that they were not intentionally minted that way, they were done with great intention by the individual, whether tourist or enthusiast, who just happened to use a vending machine to make the mark. It's not altogether different from many accepted minting processes that are discussed here at length.

I'd also argue against them being "single issue only" or "made by just one person". A single elongated penny vending machine could have had hundreds, or even thousands, of satisfied customers a day. Unlike hobo nickels or post-mint gold plated coins, these are not unique, individual specimens. These are bordering on mass produced. jim275 raised the question best, "Would they classify as Exonumia if they had used blanks instead of US pennies?".

These pieces count as tokens not only by definition but by example.

The fact is that I may never make it to the section of the catalogue that would include elongated tourist pennies, but I don't think that's a good reason for it not to exist. And I certainly don't think that's a good reason to be so dismissive in the forum. This is a wide and varied hobby, and I would hope that this catalogue would exist to match. Is this an ever-growing, unabridged index or an exclusive listing for those who tick the right boxes?
Jesse11
Joined: 30-Dec-2015
Posts: 1089
Should the catalog contain things like hobo nickels? Every one is different. If I scratch some "Spock ears" onto George Washington, should I create a page for it in Numista? Where do we draw the line?

I think the "if they had used blanks" question is actually an excellent one, but not in the way it was intended. If someone created little artistic works on oval pieces of copper, would they merit a place in the catalog? I almost think it's only because of their original existence as coins that they were added here.
MonaSeaclaid
Joined: 21-Jan-2016
Posts: 999
I didn't argue in favour of hobo nickels being added. My point was a reason for them not to be.
Jarcek Numista team
Joined: 22-Dec-2014
Posts: 5332
Reason is simple. We had to draw a line somewhere. We stopped adding tokens without pictures, cropping atarted and we drawed a line on some new additions.

It is easy to say what should be included and that we should recpect each collector wishes. But who is going to manage that. Some elongated pennies are arguably tourist tokens. Are we going to filter those which are and those which are not?

Tokens and exonumia will have their own lists in the future. Even there, lines will have to be drawn somehow. We can rethink those lines once we give them separate lists. If you wish to be really helpful, then look up recruitment thread, we are looking for new team members, or work on CCIP or work with referees by enhancing national catalogues. That can really help us and you as the final users of numista catalogue.
Catalogue administrator, Referee for Kingdom of Bohemia.
yvon
Joined: 9-Jun-2017
Posts: 341
In my opinion it is simple: these things are not usable for the purpose they were once made.
In other words they are not coins anymore, but pieces of copper or small artworks, if you like.
...you can run,  but you can't hide...
Pcoetzee5
Joined: 19-Jul-2012
Posts: 145
I appreciate the work that Jarcek and other put into the website, believe me, I have a very good understanding for that.

So perhaps we should give them the opportunity to finish their courent endevour, and support them where we can in achieving this. Once this is completed, perhaps then we can start the discussion again.

And as I said, I will be happy to add the post-production-damaged-tourist-tokens to my list of Moderations.
Ex-South African now living in Germany
lebryant
Joined: 4-Jan-2017
Posts: 75
Why would damaged coins be counted as tokens? In my eyes they're still coins but in a POOR grade.
aaronmgd
Joined: 9-Jan-2013
Posts: 666
Quote: "dltcoins"​Some are interesting and historical, such as this example from the 1904 Louisiana Purchase Exposition (World's Fair) in St. Louis, made with a contemporary Indian cent.



​wow! Love this one. I would love to pick up one of these. So interesting.
aaron
Courtesy is the one coin you can never have too much of or be stingy with.

Coin collecting is the only hobby where you can spend all your money and still have some left.
Mask
Joined: 4-Apr-2018
Posts: 106
Hi !
I got this one in Ljubljana's castle and I love it, damaged 0.05€ or not ! ^^'

blue-m
Joined: 11-Nov-2013
Posts: 130
I thought the arguments on this thread were interesting. A thought occurred to me that no one brought up at all. A better question to ask about “tokens” could be after purchasing a token could it be redeemed for a good or service? As such you could separate tokens into “private currency” or “souvenirs”. As an example Chuck E. Cheese tokens can be used to pay for games. On the other hand elongated pennies may be interesting souvenirs but you can’t use them to pay for anything. Is this train of thought used at all for deciding what is listed?
derf
Joined: 11-Mar-2012
Posts: 1562
Quote: "blue-m"Is this train of thought used at all for deciding what is listed?
​No, it's not. The train of thought of the Purist Alt-farleft Radical collectors here is that elongated pennies are deliberate post-mint coin damage. They only consider what it was before it became a tourist token.

IMHO, an elongated penny is just as much a tourist token as anything from Monnaie de Paris ...
? Format  Format  Format ?   ?
Do not argue with ignorant people .. !! They will drag you down to their level, then pulverize you with experience ...
CassTaylor
Joined: 30-May-2014
Posts: 7803
Quote: "derf"
Quote: "blue-m"Is this train of thought used at all for deciding what is listed?
​​
Purist Alt-farleft Radical collectors






​With all due respect, you need to calm down. Raving like that destroys your credibility, and does your arguments far more harm than good.

My own perspective is that there's no reason why they shouldn't be included in the tokens/exonumia section.... If you ask me it's kinda like the countermarked Spanish reales being their own type of coin. They may have been turned into trashy tourist souvenirs but to be fair that's what a lot of the contents of the tokens section is... so I wouldn't really mind if they were included, or either way for that matter.
une Franglaise; ♪ je brosse ma chevelure ♫
derf
Joined: 11-Mar-2012
Posts: 1562
Quote: "CassTaylor"
Quote: "derf"
Quote: "blue-m"Is this train of thought used at all for deciding what is listed?
​​​
​Purist Alt-farleft Radical collectors


​​With all due respect, you need to calm down. Raving like that destroys your credibility, and does your arguments far more harm than good.


​With all due respect, would you please keep your personal attack comments to yourself ...
? Format  Format  Format ?   ?
Do not argue with ignorant people .. !! They will drag you down to their level, then pulverize you with experience ...
nguzman
Joined: 3-Apr-2013
Posts: 24
I see the elongated OBJECT as a sovenier from a place one visited. So, in my opinion no longer a coin . So I believe that it has transformed into a sovenier just like a bunch of coins joined into a nice jewelry. We would not place jewelry made of coins in Numista
yvon
Joined: 9-Jun-2017
Posts: 341
Quote: "nguzman"​I see the elongated OBJECT as a sovenier from a place one visited. So, in my opinion no longer a coin . So I believe that it has transformed into a sovenier just like a bunch of coins joined into a nice jewelry. We would not place jewelry made of coins in Numista
​I guess that is the right approach.
...you can run,  but you can't hide...
Beekeeper
Joined: 9-Dec-2016
Posts: 173
Quote: "blue-m"​I thought the arguments on this thread were interesting. A thought occurred to me that no one brought up at all. A better question to ask about “tokens” could be after purchasing a token could it be redeemed for a good or service? As such you could separate tokens into “private currency” or “souvenirs”. As an example Chuck E. Cheese tokens can be used to pay for games. On the other hand elongated pennies may be interesting souvenirs but you can’t use them to pay for anything. Is this train of thought used at all for deciding what is listed?
​Here is an elongated penny that can be used as cab fare going to or from Club 21. But still a souvenir of my visit.
CassTaylor
Joined: 30-May-2014
Posts: 7803
Quote: "yvon"
Quote: "nguzman"​I see the elongated OBJECT as a sovenier from a place one visited. So, in my opinion no longer a coin . So I believe that it has transformed into a sovenier just like a bunch of coins joined into a nice jewelry. We would not place jewelry made of coins in Numista
​​I guess that is the right approach.
​Yeah, I agree, the "purist Alt-farleft Radical collector" in me wants to think those are no longer coins and should be kept out of the catalogue completely.

That being said the other side in this debate has quite a convincing argument too, as stated in my previous post, so I think I'm going to sit on the fence here.
une Franglaise; ♪ je brosse ma chevelure ♫
aaronmgd
Joined: 9-Jan-2013
Posts: 666
Quote: "Indomini16"​Hello,
​Do someone else have elongated pennie like this one ?
​Is it really common?
​I spot a Machine in Toledo, but I never pay attention before;


​Is it an idea to add it to the Token section of the catalogue?
​Thanks all in advance for your feed back !
​Yes, I have many. Probably about 150 of them.
Aaron
Courtesy is the one coin you can never have too much of or be stingy with.

Coin collecting is the only hobby where you can spend all your money and still have some left.
Ecapoe Numista team
Joined: 7-Dec-2013
Posts: 2271
Hi all,
For my sailboats collection, I have a few that I keep in a custom little album:

I find them fun and tend to agree with Derf, they are tokens. But limits are things no-one agrees with.
Tokens and exonumias sections are much better than they used to be (largely thanks to Jarek) and once will need dedicated people as referees for specific parts. Future ...

I have some to swap, with boats on. If anyone is interested :) ... And I look for more.
Let's use this thread to talk about them, the elongated pennies, cents, 5 euro cents etc.
You will notice that the elongated US cents that have a zinc core are not as nice as the 5 euro cents based "items".
Quand l'Histoire et la Géographie se croisent sur nos pièces de monnaie ...
Referee for Austria-Habsburg, Austrian Netherlands, Austrian States, Bohemia, Silesia.
Traducteur, demandez en cas de besoin ! Translator, ask if you need !
konduktors
Joined: 9-Dec-2015
Posts: 7
Quote: "Jarcek"​Reason is simple. We had to draw a line somewhere. We stopped adding tokens without pictures, cropping atarted and we drawed a line on some new additions.

​It is easy to say what should be included and that we should recpect each collector wishes. But who is going to manage that. Some elongated pennies are arguably tourist tokens. Are we going to filter those which are and those which are not?

​Tokens and exonumia will have their own lists in the future. Even there, lines will have to be drawn somehow. We can rethink those lines once we give them separate lists. If you wish to be really helpful, then look up recruitment thread, we are looking for new team members, or work on CCIP or work with referees by enhancing national catalogues. That can really help us and you as the final users of numista catalogue.
Hi

Lately, I have started to collect pressed penny coins with any military vehicles on them! It's more fun than I thought!

I think that pressed penny coins should be added to the catalog because they are representing pressing machine mints (not just a handmade jewelry), the opportunity to make them only can be given as presents/gifts or bought using cash of a penny size coin (so they have a value) and they are very interesting for a WIDE part of numismatist and non-numismatist collectors worldwide!

My offer would be this: **Exonumia** - Pressed penny coins - Name of the Country
In "Name of the Country" I meant the Country which had a contract to use a particular coin pressing machine!

Please respond to this actively!

Ugis
neilithicman
Joined: 22-Nov-2017
Posts: 678
The tokens section was supposed to be cleaned up when we had 15,000 tokens and people thought it was getting a bit out of hand. The exonumia section was established and some work was done to tidy things up, but the method chosen was far too convoluted, all the different sections, sub sections, sub sub sections, sub sub sub sections. The work was also undone by nobody restricting what is going in to the exonumia and tokens sections, and now the tokens and Exonumia sections number more than 31,000 items. It really is too big.
What? Me Worry
Indomini16
Joined: 12-Jun-2017
Posts: 339
Just found these 3 ones in Madrid :-)


still impossible to consider them as tourism tokens?
Always look on the bright side of life!
AmerSalmeh Numista team
Joined: 29-Jul-2014
Posts: 1443
Quote: "Indomini16"​Just found these 3 ones in Madrid :-)


​still impossible to consider them as tourism tokens?
​were these pressed from blanks or over cents?
Catalog Master Referee & Referee for most Arab countries
https://www.instagram.com/amer.coins
Amer Salmeh
Indomini16
Joined: 12-Jun-2017
Posts: 339
Quote: "AmerSalmeh"
Quote: "Indomini16"​Just found these 3 ones in Madrid :-)
​​
​​
​​still impossible to consider them as tourism tokens?
​​were these pressed from blanks or over cents?
​Over coins, exactly as these coins the difference is one is defined as a post dammaged object but not the other one.
Always look on the bright side of life!
derf
Joined: 11-Mar-2012
Posts: 1562
Quote: "AmerSalmeh"
Quote: "Indomini16"​Just found these 3 ones in Madrid :-)
​​
​​
​​still impossible to consider them as tourism tokens?
​​were these pressed from blanks or over cents?
​What difference does it make if one can not tell the difference .. It's all in the mind set. Either your a purist or your a numismatic collector ..
? Format  Format  Format ?   ?
Do not argue with ignorant people .. !! They will drag you down to their level, then pulverize you with experience ...
AmerSalmeh Numista team
Joined: 29-Jul-2014
Posts: 1443
Quote: "derf"
Quote: "AmerSalmeh"
​​​​were these pressed from blanks or over cents?
​​What difference does it make if one can not tell the difference .. It's all in the mind set. Either your a purist or your a numismatic collector ..
​I collect these btw :)
Just wanted to know!
Catalog Master Referee & Referee for most Arab countries
https://www.instagram.com/amer.coins
Amer Salmeh
derf
Joined: 11-Mar-2012
Posts: 1562
Quote: "AmerSalmeh"
Quote: "derf"

Quote: "AmerSalmeh"
​​​​​were these pressed from blanks or over cents?
​​​What difference does it make if one can not tell the difference .. It's all in the mind set. Either your a purist or your a numismatic collector ..
​​I collect these btw :)
​Just wanted to know!
​I'm not a purist .. I also collect them .. They are just as much a token as any other token ...
? Format  Format  Format ?   ?
Do not argue with ignorant people .. !! They will drag you down to their level, then pulverize you with experience ...
pnightingale
Joined: 27-Jul-2011
Posts: 5166
I didn't realize these were so popular. My little Princess Abby started to collect them after her first ever trip to Busch Gardens where she made herself one and thought it was the coolest thing ever. Over the years she managed to get lots of them from just about everywhere we visited plus those given to her by relatives. I even found some 2x2 cardboard flips designed to fit their elongated shape which delighted her. Maybe it's my partiality to children that makes me think these deserve a place?

I'd make an exception for both these and hobo nickels for differing reasons. Sorry guys, the PMD argument doesn't hold consistent water. We already have included the mildly controversial "1 C*NT" large cent converted into a brothel token.

There's all kinds of defaced cents being peddled most of which are pure trash. The process such as it is seems to be little more than using a crude punch to inflict a vague outline of each of our 50 states or to put a cigar in Abe's mouth. It's really no more of a "process" than it would be for me to scratch my initials in a coin. However these elongated cents are truly transformed, and hobo nickels even more so. I'd look in that direction to guide your thinking as to what should or should not be included.
Non illegitimis carborundum est.  Excellent advice for all coins.
Supreme Ruler and Dictator for Life of the 6th Avenue Coin, Stamp  & Rice Puller Club.
Indomini16
Joined: 12-Jun-2017
Posts: 339
Hi,

Just pictures of some of the pressed cents I found so far :












Always look on the bright side of life!
Iainmac
Joined: 25-Feb-2018
Posts: 427
something a bit different, some band from Liverpool,elongated British penny
people talking without speaking, people hearing without listening
jadejackal
Joined: 5-Aug-2012
Posts: 427
Quote: "pnightingale"​I'd make an exception for both these and hobo nickels for differing reasons.

​I feel like I just woke up in a different universe that is almost exactly the same as my own but has certain subtle, unnerving differences. pnightingale arguing in defense of elongated cents is one of those things.
pnightingale
Joined: 27-Jul-2011
Posts: 5166
Quote: "jadejackal"
Quote: "pnightingale"​I'd make an exception for both these and hobo nickels for differing reasons.

​​I feel like I just woke up in a different universe that is almost exactly the same as my own but has certain subtle, unnerving differences. pnightingale arguing in defense of elongated cents is one of those things.
Sentimentality has trumped consistency. I can only plead guilty as charged my friend. ​ I think we may have proven The Mandela Effect.
Non illegitimis carborundum est.  Excellent advice for all coins.
Supreme Ruler and Dictator for Life of the 6th Avenue Coin, Stamp  & Rice Puller Club.
derf
Joined: 11-Mar-2012
Posts: 1562
I posed the following question to the American Numismatic Association:

"Would the elongated tourist token (a.k.a. elongated penny) be considered in the realm of numismatics. If so, in what category would it be placed."

Here is the reply that I received:

By way of introduction, my name is Rod Gillis and I am the Education Director at the American Numismatic Association. Kim Kiick forwarded your question to me concerning elongated cents. Elongated coins are definitely a part of numismatics. As a matter of fact, there is an organization that is devoted specifically to elongated coins:

https://tecnews.org/

The category that elongated coins belong under would be exonumia.

Regards,

Rod
Rod Gillis, Education Director
American Numismatic Association
818 N. Cascade Avenue
Colorado Springs, Colorado 80903
719-482-9845
? Format  Format  Format ?   ?
Do not argue with ignorant people .. !! They will drag you down to their level, then pulverize you with experience ...
Indomini16
Joined: 12-Jun-2017
Posts: 339
Please what are the argument against them in our catalogue ?
Is it about post damage coins? If so why do we keep coins based on post damage coins in our database?

These elongated pennies are made by machines and by the way are standard.
They have a community of collector bu no databased to list them.
They are common and appreciate.
Always look on the bright side of life!
frowell
Joined: 26-Sep-2018
Posts: 36
Perhaps if the elongated token in question was pressed at some sort of historical or major event (World Fair, peace treaty, memorial, moon landing?) the interest in cataloging the item would be more substantial.

I enjoyed having a few elongated pennies my grandmother gave me when I was a kid, but I must have gotten rid of them at some point.

I don't know about the rest of the world but in the USA it seems to be a tourist gimmick sort of thing to do. Those penny elongating machines are typically found at museum gift shops and visitor centers. I was just at a visitors center on a hydro-electric dam in Oregon recently, and they had 5 different designs to choose from! I think they would be quite difficult to catalog properly.
Iainmac
Joined: 25-Feb-2018
Posts: 427
Quote: "frowell"​Perhaps if the elongated token in question was pressed at some sort of historical or major event (World Fair, peace treaty, memorial, moon landing?) the interest in cataloging the item would be more substantial.

​I enjoyed having a few elongated pennies my grandmother gave me when I was a kid, but I must have gotten rid of them at some point.

​I don't know about the rest of the world but in the USA it seems to be a tourist gimmick sort of thing to do. Those penny elongating machines are typically found at museum gift shops and visitor centers. I was just at a visitors center on a hydro-electric dam in Oregon recently, and they had 5 different designs to choose from! I think they would be quite difficult to catalog properly.
found ​exactly the same in the UK as you describe
people talking without speaking, people hearing without listening
angelsinthewindow
Joined: 16-Aug-2017
Posts: 24
Would it be better if we had a new category for tourist coins? I know it may take some time to make and a little work, but if we did that, we could further clean up the tokens a bit I think. Even making it a sub category of Token's could help a bit in that. I know I would like to list my own print coins as well since they are amazing to see and some of the older ones can be worth quite a bit now for places that no longer have the machines or are not even there anymore.
"You take the blue pill - the story ends, you wake up in your bed and believe whatever you want to believe. You take the red pill - you stay in Wonderland and I show you how deep the rabbit-hole goes."
harryg
Joined: 26-Mar-2018
Posts: 86
As previously mentioned. There is a new swapper here that I just swapped with and belongs to this club if anybody is interested in that niche of collecting.
https://tecnews.org/coins/
Oklahoman
Joined: 20-Dec-2015
Posts: 1661
Literally millions of these are possible. I have the same design from the 1994 ANA show on twenty different coins from numerous countries. I dont see how they need to be here because I had someone destroy a minted coin. I also dont see why they need to be here when I have the only known ones. I dont know how they are tokens since they do not, nor have ever circulated as part of a token economy. I think they have a place in numismatics. Perhaps on an individual's page or site...but thank God not on Numista. Cannot even get them to do banknotes, I am glad they aren't putting this sort of stuff on the website. Wouldnt it be easier for people to put a message on the host coin page of their numista collection that they have this type as a pmd elongate or something? They could do the same thing with their hobo nickels...
angelsinthewindow
Joined: 16-Aug-2017
Posts: 24
Quote: "Oklahoman"​Literally millions of these are possible. I have the same design from the 1994 ANA show on twenty different coins from numerous countries. I dont see how they need to be here because I had someone destroy a minted coin. I also dont see why they need to be here when I have the only known ones. I dont know how they are tokens since they do not, nor have ever circulated as part of a token economy. I think they have a place in numismatics. Perhaps on an individual's page or site...but thank God not on Numista. Cannot even get them to do banknotes, I am glad they aren't putting this sort of stuff on the website. Wouldnt it be easier for people to put a message on the host coin page of their numista collection that they have this type as a pmd elongate or something? They could do the same thing with their hobo nickels...
​I can refer you to what was said before:
Quote: "derf"​I posed the following question to the American Numismatic Association:

"Would the elongated tourist token (a.k.a. elongated penny) be considered in the realm of numismatics. If so, in what category would it be placed."

​Here is the reply that I received:

By way of introduction, my name is Rod Gillis and I am the Education Director at the American Numismatic Association. Kim Kiick forwarded your question to me concerning elongated cents. Elongated coins are definitely a part of numismatics. As a matter of fact, there is an organization that is devoted specifically to elongated coins:

https://tecnews.org/

​The category that elongated coins belong under would be exonumia.

​Regards,

​ Rod
​Rod Gillis, Education Director
​American Numismatic Association
​818 N. Cascade Avenue
​Colorado Springs, Colorado 80903
​719-482-9845

So they can be placed within the Exonumia category.
"You take the blue pill - the story ends, you wake up in your bed and believe whatever you want to believe. You take the red pill - you stay in Wonderland and I show you how deep the rabbit-hole goes."
Oklahoman
Joined: 20-Dec-2015
Posts: 1661
I would think Numista would do banknotes, which is actually money, before they would do damaged pieces of former money. Notwithstanding the words of a worker at the ANA, I completely agree with Numista not wanting to list all of these damaged pieces of former money. Literally every page they have on this website would have to be duplicated. That's a lot of bandwidth and money for something so few collect that even the organization dedicated to these elongated former coins has not created a website catalog. I would hope Numista would add banknotes before they add these. Mr. Gillis is not wrong. These are exonumic pieces. And as pmg damaged art items hosted on coins, they deserve to be listed. Not sure why it needs to be Numista. They haven't even listed all money yet.
CassTaylor
Joined: 30-May-2014
Posts: 7803
Quote: "Oklahoman"​I would think Numista would do banknotes, which is actually money, before they would do damaged pieces of former money.
​I agree with Oklahoman; I can honestly see why some people might want to add them, and even though I don't think the sheer volume of the varieties of these elongated pennies is an argument that discounts their inclusion in the catalogue, if I were Xavier I would choose not to as well.

Even though coins that are altered outside the mint are sometimes re-listed as types of their own (think those countermarked Spanish reales used in British colonies like Demerara and Essequibo), we need to draw the line, even for tokens/exonumia, somewhere, or else it opens up the door for every hobo nickel, counterpunch, love token, initial stamp, etc. to go into the catalogue.
une Franglaise; ♪ je brosse ma chevelure ♫
Oklahoman
Joined: 20-Dec-2015
Posts: 1661
If a collector wants to list damaged pieces of this type in Numista they already can. If your coin was a Lincoln cent then go to the Lincoln cent page. Choose any damn date or mint Mark. Select any grade and then put a comment that only you have to see. " I made this stretched penny of a donkey on this Lincoln cent at the OKC zoo," as an example.

I have hundreds of these in my collection. I have chosen to only collect ones I have personally rolled. They are neat, but they are not Numista worthy. Coins are rightly the priority...hopefully followed by banknotes soon...since they are money..,
CassTaylor
Joined: 30-May-2014
Posts: 7803
Quote: "Oklahoman"hopefully followed by banknotes soon...since they are money..,

I am this close to cramming a banknote in a Numista coin page ​just to show how it could be done, out of frustration. 8~

Just kidding, but we seriously need a banknote site like Numista. We have a banknote forum, surely that's a baby step?
une Franglaise; ♪ je brosse ma chevelure ♫

» Top of the page

Used time zone is UTC+1:00.
Current time is 07:32AM.