Position A and B....

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Hi,

I'm sorry but I cannot see the use of having two lines in the catalog for this, like for this
https://en.numista.com/catalogue/pieces71139.html

I suggest to eliminate the B line and modify the A line with a text saying: Exists with A and B positions

Edit 29/01/2018
In changing this you just have to add the two lines together

People collecting their coins by position can then make a personal comment to their year to document which position or positions they have.

I have noticed that when you swap for a given position, be it A or B, in 50% of the cases your partner got it wrong!

Edit 29/01/2018
In changing this you just have to add the two lines together. If in a swap somebody really wants to know, they can still ask their partner, if he would be so nice to indicate if it's A or B!
End edit


So what is the use of the split into two lines? When the coins are minted they have a 50% chance to be type A or type B, but that's another discussion.

Ole
Globetrotter
Coin varieties in French:
https://monnaiesetvarietes.numista.com
Yes, please abolish this A/B distinction.
Hear hear ... unless it's warranted where one orientation should be but isn't like in the case of the old 5 France pieces of Belgium
+1
Library Media Specialist, columnist, collector, and gardener...
Quote: "Idolenz"​Hear hear ... unless it's warranted where one orientation should be but isn't like in the case of the old 5 France pieces of Belgium
​and that's where it all started. The Belgian coins I have with A and B, which is OK, but only there!

Ole
Globetrotter
Coin varieties in French:
https://monnaiesetvarietes.numista.com
Hello.
There are also Canadian coins in the catalog with such a division. I'm also against this.

Edit:
done
and the newer American dollars.... Romania also have some 50 bani with A and B!!! There are certainly others just escaping me now.

Ole
Globetrotter
Coin varieties in French:
https://monnaiesetvarietes.numista.com
Some Spanish pesetas have A/B positions.
Referee for Spain, Iberia (ancient), Suebi Kingdom and Visigothic Kingdom
SO, ...  !!! while you're at, why not delete the mint mark annotation also ....  ????
? Format  Format  Format ?   ?
Do not argue with ignorant people .. !! They will drag you down to their level, then pulverize you with experience ...
Quote: "derf"​SO, ...  !!! while you're at, why not delete the mint mark annotation also ....  ????
​and how did the mint marks come into the discussion???? I don't understand how you connect them to the A and B positions?

Ole
Globetrotter
Coin varieties in French:
https://monnaiesetvarietes.numista.com
It should be only there where it is justified - aka Belgium. Where it is random 50x50, let's erase it.
Catalogue administrator
Hi Jarek,

Not erase it, but just make a comment like this "Is found with pos A & B" on the single year line remaining. People can then, if they collect by A & B, give that information in the personal comments field.

Ole
Globetrotter
Coin varieties in French:
https://monnaiesetvarietes.numista.com
I would only point out A/B option in the edge field or the comment field as it applies for all years ... This to prevent the year-comment-field from being overloaded.
Just call me Bram

Oh! And do read my profile page before you open a swap ...
I can easily live with that...

Ole
Globetrotter
Coin varieties in French:
https://monnaiesetvarietes.numista.com
Quote: "Jarcek"​It should be only there where it is justified - aka Belgium. Where it is random 50x50, lets erase it.

​It would be nice to fix it in the rules.
I like how the US did it with the Olympic baseball coin. The lettering alternated up down up down on the same coin.. frustrated dozens of Belgian collectors. ( just teasing any Belgian friends.)
Library Media Specialist, columnist, collector, and gardener...
Quote: "Oklahoman"​I like how the US did it with the Olympic baseball coin. The lettering alternated up down up down on the same coin.. frustrated dozens of Belgian collectors. ( just teasing any Belgian friends.)
​Hi,

I just suppose that kind of "dirty" tricks would make some people start to collect on starting points of the never ending rim.....

Ole
Globetrotter
Coin varieties in French:
https://monnaiesetvarietes.numista.com
Lol. We collectors can be some kind of passionate sometimes!
Library Media Specialist, columnist, collector, and gardener...
Quote: "Sjoelund"
Quote: "derf"​SO, ...  !!! while you're at, why not delete the mint mark annotation also ....  ????
​​and how did the mint marks come into the discussion???? I don't understand how you connect them to the A and B positions?

​Ole
​I am 100% for getting rid of the silly A vs B thing. It's at random. I've been pushing for this for years.


I'm following the rule to combine A & B since I have received this instruction in 2016. I support this decision. As to merge the dates (before 2016) that have this distinction is beyond my authority.
z) Oh my, to which poor soul I promised to get rid of all those! Anyway I am sorry.
Catalogue administrator
Hello,

I don't make a distinction in A/B my self, but for the ones who do why not let them have it ?!?

Does this create a problem for others ? If not, why change what is in place already ?

Respectfully,

André

P.S, Sorry for the translation, I used google for english.
Québécois

Ancienement, référent du Canada /  FYI former referee for Canada
Hi André,

the problem is when you swap.... most people just enter their coin in the first line (50% chance of the coin belonging there). If you collect by position, you might get the proper coin in 50% of the cases, but is that good enough for you? When you swap, you can see your partner's comments, so if he's bothered to say if the coin is Pos A or B, you ought to believe him. If nothing is said about, you're back to the 50/50!

le problème est quand tu fais une échange... le plupart de gens saisissent leur pièce dans la première ligne (50% de chance que la pièce est dans la ligne correcte). Si tu collecte par position, tu reçoit la pièce correcte dans 50% de cas, mais est-ce-que assez bien pour toi? Quand tu fais une échange tu peux lire les commentaires de ton partenaire et si il a écrit que sa pièce est soit Pos A ou B, tu peux être sure a 99% que c'est vraiment ça. Si il n y a pas des commentaires tu retourne vers 50/50!

Ole
Globetrotter
Coin varieties in French:
https://monnaiesetvarietes.numista.com
Quote: "bbybugs"

​I'm following the rule to combine A & B since I have received this instruction in 2016. I support this decision. As to merge the dates (before 2016) that have this distinction is beyond my authority.

​I see it's already done for Canada so what happen to the inventory of those who entered coins when the distinction was made between A an d B ??? I remember at first entering my coins with this distinction. Did someone adjusted the quantity automatically or do have to redo my inventory for those coins ???

In the french description some times I see this Tirage A et B / Tranche A (Lettres dirigées vers l'avers) to help people distinguish wich are A's from B's. I find it usefull ans suggest we all do this.

Regards,

André
Québécois

Ancienement, référent du Canada /  FYI former referee for Canada
Hi,

I thought the agreement was to leave a fixed text saying something similar to this for each year line:
Position A & B exist. This has not been done!
or Tirage A et B / Tranche A (Lettres dirigées vers l'avers) = Position A and B exist / Edge of A (Letters towards the obverse) / B (Letters towards the reverse)

If a person has a coin in the line with Pos A and also a coin in the line with Pos B, then the new resulting line should add the two lines, so would you now find 2 coins in the the new line. This seems to be the case, I've checked my 50 bani coins (km192), BUT a new personal comment had been created as well. The line showed TWO coins, but the comment mentioned only the Pos B coin?

Ole
Globetrotter
Coin varieties in French:
https://monnaiesetvarietes.numista.com
Hello again,

Even if i'm new as a referee and it seems like no one else agree's with me...

In my opinion, if only one person (and I know that some people do in Canada) collect those coins with the distinction between A and B, we should, on this site, offer the possibility to do so and inventory them as well.

If it was important to me as a collector I would really appreciate being able to use the option and very usefull to rapidly view if i'm missing a variety.

Is it not just one of the bases of collecting to get one coin of every variety when it exist?

The trading problem you are mentionning comes after collecting and inventorying and can be solved with good communications. To me it's not relevant at the collection and inventoring stage. Before any trade, trading partners should make sure they are trading the right coin variety if there is a variety to the coin they are trading...no ?

Best regards,

André
Québécois

Ancienement, référent du Canada /  FYI former referee for Canada
Quote: "Québécois"​Hello again,

​​The trading problem you are mentionning comes after collecting and inventorying and can be solved with good communications. To me it's not relevant at the collection and inventoring stage. Before any trade, trading partners should make sure they are trading the right coin variety if there is a variety to the coin they are trading...no ?

​Best regards,

​André





​If we had left it like it was, then we would know, that those lines would not be truthful. I have up to now never been asked if my coins for swap were A or B!

Now, if people collect by A and B, they can still ask when trading. The people collectiong like that can write in their personel comment on the line: (Pos A) or (Pos B ) or (Pos A & B), that way they personally know excactly what they have, just like before. The count is still correct.

Ole
Globetrotter
Coin varieties in French:
https://monnaiesetvarietes.numista.com
I like that people can write in their comments if they have A or B. This also allows for collectors who do not use the designation to be able to complete listings by date. Something they cannot do if they have to choose A or B. By designating in comments, we accommodate all of the ways of collecting, A or B or nothing at all.
Library Media Specialist, columnist, collector, and gardener...
Quote: "Sjoelund"
Quote: "Québécois"​Hello again,

​​​The trading problem you are mentionning comes after collecting and inventorying and can be solved with good communications. To me it's not relevant at the collection and inventoring stage. Before any trade, trading partners should make sure they are trading the right coin variety if there is a variety to the coin they are trading...no ?
​​
​​Best regards,
​​
​​André



​​If we had left it like it was, then we would know, that those lines would not be truthful. I have up to now never been asked if my coins for swap were A or B!

​Now, if people collect by A and B, they can still ask when trading. The people collectiong like that can write in their personel comment on the line: (Pos A) or (Pos B) or (Pos A & B), that way they personally know excactly what they have, just like before. The count is still correct.

​Ole
​My friend Sjoelind,

It seems like I really don't get your point and that we will never agree on this.

It's not because you were never ask for a coin of type A or B that other people didn't. I took a quick look at your collection, you don't have any of these Canadian coins of type A or B up to trade. Maybe this explains why you were never asked. ;-)

Those are types of coins that exist and as a collector I should be able to quickly differentiate them in my inventory. As a collector I would like to know how many coins of type A and how many of type B I have in my collection without having to go trought the comment field to find out. I would like to quickly know if I am missing a type for a specific year.

We are not talking about errors here but types of coins that were stroke intentionnaly this way.

The real question is... If someone is too ignorant or lazy to properly identify his coins should we all do the same ???

If I push your thinking to the limit, why bother differentiate a year from another one, I could just use the comment field and enter the years there.

Regards,
Québécois

Ancienement, référent du Canada /  FYI former referee for Canada
Hi,

I see where you're heading, but it's a bit simplistic I find. As you certainly know, that if somebody is into variants, it's me. Now Pos A and B are NOT variants, just a happenchance, which can go either A or B and with the law of big numbers, they are distributed evenly with 50% to each.

For years I DID collect by position, but after numerous discussions on this forum I also finshed by accepting the idea of not collecting coins like that any longer (in 2014, I think). In my collection excel sheet, I still have the Pos A and B from the time before. Even in Numista!

Look here https://en.numista.com/catalogue/pieces4768.html
My page looks like this now:

and I'll leave it like that and live happily ever after. Now I can be flexible, give in the information or not, just as I feel that given day.

Ole
Globetrotter
Coin varieties in French:
https://monnaiesetvarietes.numista.com
I'm glad this has already been decided. I agree that this is a randomness that folks could put in their own comments.
Library Media Specialist, columnist, collector, and gardener...
Quote: "Sjoelund"​Hi,

​I see where you're heading, but it's a bit simplistic I find. As you certainly, that if somebody is into variants, it's me. Now Pos A and B are NOT variants, just a happenchance, which can go either A or B and with the law of big numbers, they are distributed evenly with 50% to each.

​For years I DID collect by position, but after numerous discussions on this forum I also finshed by accepting the idea of not collecting coins like that any longer (in 2014, I think). In my collection excel sheet, I still have the Pos A and B from the time before. Even in Numista!

​Look here https://en.numista.com/catalogue/pieces4768.html
​My page looks like this now:

​and I'll leave it like that and live happily ever after. Now I can be flexible, give in the information or not, just as I feel that given day.

​Ole
​Hi again,

I don't care what are the chances of a coin to be of type A or type B when they are stroke. When you buy a roll of 25 coins, you can get 20 coins of type A and 5 coins of type B...or 25 type A and none of type b. Same with the 5 coins sets they are selling (you can get 5 coins of a type and none of the other). For some people if they don't have a type B in their 25 coins roll or 5 coins set, they will be looking for them. It's their way of collecting and they have the right to do so... don't you think ?

I'm from Canada and I can assure you that when the new coins got out with these lettering, people were trading coins like crazy to make sure they had both type A and type B in their collection. You can verify this on the Numicanada free site witch is a great, if not the greatest, french reference site for Canadian coins.

Now you all have to realise that this still matters to some collectors in Canada. From your point of view it might not be relevant but...hey... you are not the ones who are collecting these coins so why try to transpose your reallity and views ?!?

Now I don't know if there is still an opening to debate this but I will see with the other canadian referee what he thinks of it.

Best regards,

André

P.S. http://www.numicanada.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=28&t=15523&hilit=Type+A+type+B+deux+dollars
Québécois

Ancienement, référent du Canada /  FYI former referee for Canada
Hi André,

but nothing has really changed, have a look at my Romanian 50 bani coins. Your compatriots and everybody else can still collect by position, see my 5 bani coins again.



Ole
Globetrotter
Coin varieties in French:
https://monnaiesetvarietes.numista.com
Quote: "Québécois"​I'm from Canada and I can assure you that when the new coins got out with these lettering, people were trading coins like crazy to make sure they had both type A and type B in their collection. You can verify this on the Numicanada free site witch is a great, if not the greatest, french reference site for Canadian coins.

​Best regards,

​André

​P.S. http://www.numicanada.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=28&t=15523&hilit=Type+A+type+B+deux+dollars



​Hi again,

I don't mind at all that Canada would still stay with two lines, one pos A and one Pos B, but if it that is accepted, then please make a THIRD line for the people not caring (Pos A or Pos B).

This is called a compromise to make EVERYBODY happy.

Have a nice Sunday evening

Ole
Globetrotter
Coin varieties in French:
https://monnaiesetvarietes.numista.com
Oh boy...

In this case, a third type doesn't exist. I don't see why we should add a line.

We should NOT add a line for every coin that beginners aren't able (or are to lazy) to identify correctly. 8)

Sorry I don't agree again. z)

It seems like time proved the overall value and rarity of type A and B are the same for Canadian coins, so this is not really an issue anymore. It was was back in 2012 when collectors were looking for the 2 types of coins like if their collection value was depending on this. Probably, if you ask them today, most of them would have a different point of view now. Since a merge of type A and B was done for Canadian coins, I would not change it back.

The reason I am arguing is that the value or rarity might be different for future coins and I still think we should have different types on different lines (like it was in the beginning). With out proper knowledge of rarity and value of a type of coin, it is the right thing to do, at the moment of creation of the coin, to differenciate the types. True we can allways adjust later on... if having different types isn't usefull to anyone (value wise or numismatically wise).

André
Québécois

Ancienement, référent du Canada /  FYI former referee for Canada
Hi André,

I give up. Help yourself to the last communication.

Ciao

Ole
Globetrotter
Coin varieties in French:
https://monnaiesetvarietes.numista.com
Quote: "Sjoelund"​... but if it that is accepted, then please make a THIRD line for the people not caring (Pos A or Pos B)...
And while your at it please add 359 additional lines for every line in A and B for the different startings of the text, they have the same legitimacy as position A&B (8

Quote: "Oklahoman"​I'm glad this has already been decided. I agree that this is a randomness that folks could put in their own comments.
​Thanks to the friends

Ole
Globetrotter
Coin varieties in French:
https://monnaiesetvarietes.numista.com
Quote: "Sjoelund"
Quote: "Oklahoman"​I like how the US did it with the Olympic baseball coin. The lettering alternated up down up down on the same coin.. frustrated dozens of Belgian collectors. ( just teasing any Belgian friends.)
​​Hi,

​I just suppose that kind of "dirty" tricks would make some people start to collect on starting points of the never ending rim.....

​Ole
​As I mentioned earlier.....

Ole
Globetrotter
Coin varieties in French:
https://monnaiesetvarietes.numista.com
Quote: "Québécois"​Even if i'm new as a referee and it seems like no one else agree's with me...

​Hey André, don't worry, you're not the only one on this, I'm 100 % agreed with your vision.

People who like it will use every argument to defend it, people who don't like it will use every argument to oppose it. That's the way it is and it probably will never change. I can live with that.
BUT if you use some arguments take good care and be honest to avoid cutting in your own fingers. Ole, your main argument is "I have noticed that when you swap for a given position, in 50% of the cases your partner got it wrong!". I have to agree on that, that's why I always ask my swap partner to verify the edge position. The reason is people who don't care about the edge position don't make an effort to thick the right box, and no problem, I can totally understand that, hence my asking when I select such a coin in a swap.
But: Ole, you're a big lover of varieties, me too, but most of the collectors don't care about varieties and as a result I have noticed that when you swap varieties in 50% of the cases your partner got it wrong! So what's next? Deleting the year lines for varieties and merge the year lines and variety collectors should put a personal comment in the comment box? If we follow your main argument for the edge position we should use if for varieties as well because it is exactly the same argument and I'm sure then you won't be happy at all, on the contrary.
Quote: "Oklahoman"I like that people can write in their comments if they have A or B. This also allows for collectors who do not use the designation to be able to complete listings by date. Something they cannot do if they have to choose A or B. By designating in comments, we accommodate all of the ways of collecting, A or B or nothing at all.
This looks easy but it isn't. You only look from the opponent's point of view but you forget one very important thing for the proponent: if we merge the A and B lines we never see the blue exclamation mark anymore while checking an exchange list as soon as we have one of the two edge positions for a certain year. So we never can swap edge positions anymore unless we go back to the stone age and check exchange lists manually instead of using our fantastic Numista swap program.
So I rather take the chance my swap partner has the edge position wrong and I have to ask him first before finishing a swap.
There is that...yeesh...
Library Media Specialist, columnist, collector, and gardener...
Quote: "Oklahoman"​There is that...yeesh...
​My google translate says "yeesh" is Somalian. So I have absolutely no idea what you mean.
Essor Prof
If we merge the A and B lines we never see the blue exclamation mark anymore while checking an exchange list as soon as we have one of the two edge positions for a certain year. So we never can swap edge positions anymore unless we go back to the stone age and check exchange lists manually instead of using our fantastic Numista swap program.


That's true, but doesn't that imply, that we need a third line, for the people ignoring the Pos A / B? You can not force collectors to look at the edges and remember how to determine the writing compared to the obverse and reverse sides of the coin......

Ole
Globetrotter
Coin varieties in French:
https://monnaiesetvarietes.numista.com
Hello.
All Soviet commemorative coins 1 ruble, all Russian commemorative bimetallic coins 10 rubles have inscriptions on the edge. And I consistently reject proposals to divide them into types A and B . Because there is no such in any catalog, because the catalog will cease to be convenient for everyone, because for this there are personal comments.
And there are old silver and gold coins with inscriptions on the edge, there are almost all types of coins 2 euros. For all cases that are random (orientation of the inscription, defective stamping, stamp depreciation, random orientation when hand-stamping medieval coins) there are personal comments.
The reason collectors collect by date or variety is because some are less common than others. In almost all cases, A/B are equally common. Why bother?

I refuse to double the burden and expense of collecting edge-lettered coins just to include a purely random non-distinction that rarely has meaningful numismatic importance.
Yes, please remove the A/B designations for ALL coins. As far as the US is concerned, only the grading companies make the distinction, IMO it's because it allows them to sell more slabs. A simple comment about the two types would suffice.
Sooo...what are we going to do?
Library Media Specialist, columnist, collector, and gardener...
I agree with getting rid of A & B ... It's a pain in the A(rse) .. or is it the B(um)?

Lol - Mike
Referee for Australia & New Zealand Coins & Exonumia, Papua New Guinea & Cocos & Keeling Islands Coins & Australian Banknotes. I Collect > Australia, UK & Dependancies, NZ Sets, USA & Euros plus Misc Exonumia.
I do not agree with removing them, but they are being removed by year for the US.
Obviously and luckily they will be removed.
I'm a big fan of coin varieties, but for me posA and posB are the same, if the lettering is exactly the same.

But the further problem would be Malaysia 50 Sen (KM#53). They have many different edge lettering. I think this is more important than posA/posB, as the edge is the third side of the coins.
Catalog editor for Thailand and Japan.
Contact me via facebook if you want to swap/buy. See my profile.
Found another page
https://en.numista.com/catalogue/pieces683.html
Hello,

For the french coins, these differences must be keep for some reasons : it concerned only one type of coins : 10 francs Mathieu and commemoratives : It's the only french coin with slice different position.
These two positions have different lines in Le Franc, the reference book for french coins, so many french coin collectors collect the two slices. It's the only time of the french Franc that the new technical struck does two different slices.
When the particularity is collected so much, i think it can be conserved on Numista.
If you errase this, why don't you errase some other varieties of french coins : i speak about the 9 / 2 / 3 closed ou opened for the 20s 30s coins ? (50 cts / 1 fr / 2 frs Domard et Morlon bronze-aluminium)
Theses varieties on Numista aren't in Le Franc for a good reason : for the scientific comity edition, a variety is defined by a different die or matrix. The 9 / 2 / 3 opened or closed don't come from a different die or matrix : there are conserved to MDP and when there are observed, they see that fo each year, there are an only matrix with opened numbers : the closed numbers come from stuffy die in numbers.

But here, for the two slices, it's not a different equipment that created this, it's a different struck technical. In itself, for the same year, it's two different coins : one with the A position slice and one with the B position slice.

These difference can be see on 2 euros but it's all on two euros, every time and states that it can be see. It's not a particularity of one state, or for one year or for one coin type. Moreover, the difference for 2 euro is collected by a minimal group of collectors, the difference isn't entered in reference book.

I preach for french coins but i think it can be conserved because it's in the greastest french coins book and for the numbers of collectors.

Sorry if my english is sometimes approximative.
what do you mean with "erase pos A and B"? :o for coins like this it's a a huge difference between pos A and pos B..
Coin referee for: AZE, FRO, GRL, US-HI, KOR, KGZ, MLI, MHL, MMR, PRK, UZB, SML, TAT, TWN, TJK
Banknote referee for: AGO, AZE, BLR, ECS, GEO, HTI, KAZ, KGZ, KOR, MNG, MRT, PMR, PRK, ROK, SWE, TJK, TKM, TUR, UZB, WSM, ZWE
Quote: "ngdawa"​what do you mean with "erase pos A and B"? :o for coins like this it's a a huge difference between pos A and pos B..
​For coins where edge text orientation actually matters, we should say so in the comments, and allow the A/B lines to remain.

But for most edge lettered coins, A/B is insignificant.
Quote: "ngdawa"​what do you mean with "erase pos A and B"? :o for coins like this it's a a huge difference between pos A and pos B..
​What does this mean for the catalogue? This can only be relevant for certain collectors, for this there are personal comments.
It seems that this dispute will never end. It would be good to write this question in the guideline.
Edit: done.
Quote: "Cyrillius"​​What does this mean for the catalogue? This can only be relevant for certain collectors, for this there are personal comments.
​It seems that this dispute will never end. It would be good to write this question in the guideline.
​for the catalogue it means a lot! it'll make the catalogue more complete and accurate with the reality..one could argue the same with km#'s, especially when it comes to ".1" and ".2" etc..

then, what it what means for the collectors on this site, well, that's a different story..i won't make a fuzz and fight for this, but i would be sad to see the details disappear..it's the details that make this site even more special..but if there is a vote and the majority votes for remove it, then that's the way we'll go..
Coin referee for: AZE, FRO, GRL, US-HI, KOR, KGZ, MLI, MHL, MMR, PRK, UZB, SML, TAT, TWN, TJK
Banknote referee for: AGO, AZE, BLR, ECS, GEO, HTI, KAZ, KGZ, KOR, MNG, MRT, PMR, PRK, ROK, SWE, TJK, TKM, TUR, UZB, WSM, ZWE
There was already a discussion here, there was already a solution (look at the whole topic). And we return to this question again. Unbelievable. And we are not talking about registering any important or unimportant differences (by the way, which make some pages simply unused. Well, let's register dates with each stamp number?). We are talking only about the random orientation of the inscription on the edge.
This was decided a long time ago. Keep lines where it is relevant and not 50/50 chance.

Where it is a chance, comment is sufficient.
Catalogue administrator
Quote: "ngdawa"
Quote: "Cyrillius"​​What does this mean for the catalogue? This can only be relevant for certain collectors, for this there are personal comments.
​​It seems that this dispute will never end. It would be good to write this question in the guideline.
​​for the catalogue it means a lot! it'll make the catalogue more complete and accurate with the reality..one could argue the same with km#'s, especially when it comes to ".1" and ".2" etc..

​then, what it what means for the collectors on this site, well, that's a different story..i won't make a fuzz and fight for this, but i would be sad to see the details disappear..it's the details that make this site even more special..but if there is a vote and the majority votes for remove it, then that's the way we'll go..
​The details will remain in the comments, but at least the errors in swapping will be eliminated....
Globetrotter
Coin varieties in French:
https://monnaiesetvarietes.numista.com

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