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Denomination of Panamá coins

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oynbcn
Joined: 21-Sep-2014
Posts: 31
Hello partners: In relation to the denominations of the currencies of Panama, I believe that the criterion is wrong.
In the currencies of 1/4 Balboa and of 1/10 Balboa, in Numista the catalog expresses it as 1 Decimo and 1 Cuarto. The currency is the Balboa, not Decimo or Cuarto so I thought the currency should be expressed as 1/10 Balboa and 1/4 Balboa.
As an example, it could serve Jersey, where the currencies are expressed as 1/4 Shilling, 1/12 Shilling or even India, 1/4 Anna, 1/2 Rupee, etc ...
What you think about this?
Regards, Oscar
Ecapoe Numista team
Joined: 7-Dec-2013
Posts: 2271
Hello,
what you see is the "name" of the coin. What was chosen is to keep what is written on the coin rather than changing it to the value.
You can see that 25 cents coins are either cuartos or 25 centesimos depending on what is on the coin, following the decision of the country when the coin was issued.
The value itself in relation to the currency is in the blue frame on the right.

Regards.
Quand l'Histoire et la Géographie se croisent sur nos pièces de monnaie ...
Referee for Austria-Habsburg, Austrian Netherlands, Austrian States, Bohemia, Silesia.
Traducteur, demandez en cas de besoin ! Translator, ask if you need !
oynbcn
Joined: 21-Sep-2014
Posts: 31
Hi, I think the problem is not on the denomination of the coin, when the coin is 1/4 de balboa or 25 centésimos.
For me the problem is the different way to write this: example...

https://en.numista.com/catalogue/pieces18310.html
On the coin is write One quarter anna, and the denomination in Numista Catalog is 1/4 Anna (the correct way in my opinion)

https://en.numista.com/catalogue/pieces3034.html
On the coin says Un cuarto de Balboa (the same than in India British coin), and the denomination in Numista Catalog is 1 Cuarto. The correct way, in my opinión, might be 1/4 Balboa. You would write 1 Quarter in the India coin?

Thanks.
CassTaylor
Joined: 30-May-2014
Posts: 7813
I agree with Ecapoe, for example it would seem to be quite wrong to make this coin's name "1/20 Pound - George V", because "One Shilling" is what is on the coin; and usually I'd agree that what is written on the coin is the best indicator of what to use.

For this case I think 1/4 Balboa is a completely reasonable (and actually, preferable) option to "1 Cuarto". On the coin it says "Un Cuarto de Balboa" (a quarter of a Balboa) anyway, so we'd be going by the above rule; besides I don't think using 1/4 Balboa would confuse anyone.
une Franglaise; ♪ je brosse ma chevelure ♫
Ecapoe Numista team
Joined: 7-Dec-2013
Posts: 2271
Hello,
I think this is more a question of colours and opinions than wrong or right.
Let's let the referee decide :)
After all refs do have some level of autonomy don't they, re:)
Quand l'Histoire et la Géographie se croisent sur nos pièces de monnaie ...
Referee for Austria-Habsburg, Austrian Netherlands, Austrian States, Bohemia, Silesia.
Traducteur, demandez en cas de besoin ! Translator, ask if you need !
oynbcn
Joined: 21-Sep-2014
Posts: 31
Hello colleagues, I know that this issue was discussed a few months ago but I still do not understand why the denomination of certain Panama coins is not modified. For me, it should not be at the discretion of the referee of each issuer, but Numista as Catalog should have a unified criterion when it comes to denominating the coins. If the criterion is 1/4 and not a quarter or quarter, it should be the same for all countries. Another example, coins from Mauritius:
https://en.numista.com/catalogue/pieces6839.html
https://en.numista.com/catalogue/pieces34037.html
I think that if there is no unified criterion it is detrimental to the users of Numista. What do you think about the subject?
Regards, Oscar
BCNumismatics
Joined: 24-Jan-2009
Posts: 427
The denominations should be expressed as both a fraction & as a denomination - for example, a coin inscribed 'Medio Balboa' should be listed as both 1/2 Balboa & as 50 Centesimos.

The 1/10 Balboa is also 10 Centesimos.

There is the silver 2-1/2 Centesimos - which is better known as the Panama Pill.

The Panamanian Balboa is pegged at 1:1 to the American Dollar.

The American Dollar is also legal tender in Panama as well.

Aidan.
ken6528
Joined: 11-Sep-2009
Posts: 1197
I think the currency should be expressed as 1/10 Balboa and 1/4 Balboa. That would keep them in the same format as USA coins. (1/4 Dollar for quarters)

If there is no good reasons not to do the changes, I will start to change them.
Numista referee for British Antarctic Territory, British Indian Ocean Territory, United States, Fiji, Cook Islands, Philippines, Vanuatu
BCNumismatics
Joined: 24-Jan-2009
Posts: 427
Quote: "ken6528"​I think the currency should be expressed as 1/10 Balboa and 1/4 Balboa. That would keep them in the same format as USA coins. (1/4 Dollar for quarters)

​If there is no good reasons not to do the changes, I will start to change them.

How about including their denominations in Centesimos as well?

1/10 Balboa = 10 Centesimos.


Aidan.
ken6528
Joined: 11-Sep-2009
Posts: 1197
It depends what is on the coin.
If it has the word balboa it should be listed in that form
If it has Centesimos it should be written that way.
Numista referee for British Antarctic Territory, British Indian Ocean Territory, United States, Fiji, Cook Islands, Philippines, Vanuatu
oynbcn
Joined: 21-Sep-2014
Posts: 31
Totally agree with you.
ken6528
Joined: 11-Sep-2009
Posts: 1197
They should all be done now. If you see any mistakes tell me.
Numista referee for British Antarctic Territory, British Indian Ocean Territory, United States, Fiji, Cook Islands, Philippines, Vanuatu
Oklahoman
Joined: 20-Dec-2015
Posts: 1662
Shouldn't collectors and experts of Panamanian coins determine how they are addressed? It seems odd that how the British collectors of Indian coins would set a standard for what central Americans call their own coins. Seems like the rule that should be in place is what the coin says. I mean I have still to meet an Irishman that called his coins what Numista calls them...but Numista calls them that because that is what it says on the coin. USA also calls quarters two bits. I dont think that should be the denomination of the coin on Numista. Call it what it says it is.
Sjoelund
Joined: 28-Mar-2012
Posts: 2145
Quote: "Oklahoman"Call it what it says it is.

​Seems rather logical to me, so please go on using what's written on the coin, which is what the collector actually can see.

Ole
Globetrotter
Coin variants in English:
https://sites.google.com/site/coinvarietiescollection/home
In French on Cobra's site (not the same)
http://monnaiesetvarietes.esy.es/
ngdawa
Joined: 18-Oct-2011
Posts: 2666
Quote: "Sjoelund"
Quote: "Oklahoman"Call it what it says it is.

​​Seems rather logical to me, so please go on using what's written on the coin, which is what the collector actually can see.

​Ole
​The only problem here is that, in the Panama case, me might end up with 15 pcs of "1 Cuarto de Balboa", 5 pcs of "¼ Balboa" and 8 pcs of "25 Centésimos". All three has the same denomination but are expressed differently. Just use the same pattern for all of the same denomination, otherwise it will look like a rookie has done it.

In the USA catalogue we have both "1 Dime" and "10 Cents", even it neither is printed on the coin.
10 Cents: https://en.numista.com/catalogue/pieces102971.html
1 Dime: https://en.numista.com/catalogue/pieces30320.html
My goal is to have at least 1 coin from each modern country.
Countries left: 17
Oklahoman
Joined: 20-Dec-2015
Posts: 1662
If the value is expressed in digits then the listings will be indexed properly. Go with what the coins say. Can you imagine a newbie wondering why the hell they cant find a coin because some numista snobs want to call a coin something that is expressed as something else on the coin?

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